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Unauthorized Work Take-Down Request (Please Help!)

  • Sirlegolot
    Sirlegolot closed this thread because:
    Conflicts Resolved.
    14:01, September 2, 2016

    Foreword: Hello, I’ve already contacted Luftificus and the Council about this matter but given Luftificus seldom seems to check in these days and from what I’m to understand doesn’t really want to intervene in group management, and that the Council has to my knowledge made no progress towards acting to resolve this matter, I’ve decided, or I’m really hoping at least, taking this to a public setting, where I'm easily able to address any concerns, is likely to be my best bet for resolving this matter.

    I know many of us have had our differences in the past and as such we all have rather strong feelings for each other, however I take this matter very seriously and I’d ask that you put those feelings for me aside so we can focus on the issue at hand; I’m raising this issue because I sincerely am concerned about it. Thank you, and thank you for any assistance in this matter.




    It’s come to my attention that several derivative versions of my work have been published and used by the group on this wiki. While I am content with the work I originally let the group use staying in place, if just because I recognize how unrealistic it’d be to try to take all of it down given its quantity, I am not however comfortable with the existence and use of these derivative versions of my work which I must note I did not consent to or authorize the creation of and did not give to the group for its use.

    This is the list of the infringing assets as I could find them from a quick skim:

    • "SAPIV.png",
    • "Attention.png",
    • "Discuss.png",
    • "Featured.png",
    • "SFMBWikiBanner_Large.png",
    • "SFMB_Banner_2.0.png",
    • "SFMB_Wiki_Large_Banner.png",
    • "Wiki-wordmark.png",
    • "Admin.png",
    • "SAPIII_Logo.png”,
    • "Welcome_picture_main_page_SFMB.png",
    • "Stellar_Adventures_Project_main_page_SFMB.png"


    To address some big points I foresee coming up here real quick (by all means skim down to the points most relevant to whatever concerns you may have):


    What right do I have to request this work be taken down?
    TL;DR - You’ve breached my copyright as well as in the process the Wikia Terms of Use.
    Under US copyright law I inherently own the copyright to my work upon its creation, as such I also hold the exclusive right to its use, distribution, and to authorizing derivatives - or edits or remakes - of my work; I have in no manner signed that right away at any point in my membership or leadership of SFMB.
    The creation of a derivative work based on my work without my consent is a breach of that copyright, furthermore while the criteria isn’t very clean cut, I do feel that your use of these derivative works does not qualify for fair use, not least of all because it is not a transformative work, which the Copyright Office says that “Transformative uses are those that add something new, with a further purpose or different character, and do not substitute for the original use of the work.”
    Furthermore, in using these unauthorized versions of my work, the Sci Fi Mini Builders Wiki and those involved in it have breached the Wikia Terms of Use, namely the ToU states that “You agree that you will not use the Service in any manner that is contrary to the Wikia Community Guidelines, which may be updated from time to time. Without limiting the foregoing, you also agree not to use the Service to: [...] Post any illegal or unauthorized content or use for any illegal or unauthorized purposes; [...] Violate any laws in your jurisdiction (including but not limited to copyright laws and laws regarding online conduct and acceptable content)”.

    Aren’t I going back on my past advocacy for a policy against deleting content submitted to group projects?
    TL;DR - No. I didn’t give the group these images, nor did I authorize their creation.
    I can understand where that idea might be coming from, but the answer quite frankly is no, because I never gave these materials to the group to use. I did not authorize or in any way consent to the creation or use of these new versions of my work and as such could not have submitted them to the group.
    Further, so far as I can recall that policy was only ever applied to written work - to roleplay, not to images, especially not to original images which would fall under the scope of copyright law, but again even if that policy did apply to images it can’t be applied to images which the original author didn’t consent to the group using to begin with.

    What does any of this really matter, it doesn’t hurt me right?
    TL;DR - It does.
    It does actually matter quite a lot, I put a lot of labor into my work and it does cause me distress to see it, and my rights to it, abused like this. If someone had wanted to get my permission to make a new version of my work they need only have asked, but unfortunately you didn’t and I can’t ignore that.

    Why should you fulfill my request, what does this matter to you?
    TL;DR - It’s the right thing, and it costs you nothing to resolve this liability to the group.
    Because we may not have always gotten along but you aren’t totally terrible people, this is by all metrics the right thing to do and I know many on the Council are on average inclined to do the right thing.
    It also doesn’t cost you anything, in my discussions with some admins so far I’ve even been lead to believe most of these infringing images aren’t even relevant or useful to the group anymore as it moves to a new project - the group is entering a new era with a new theme and is likely to rebrand itself as such, rendering seemingly all of this unauthorized work useless to you, as such why fight to keep it around? Especially when you consider it’s a liability to the group and the wiki, if just because Wikia could take measures against the SFMB wiki because of copyright breaches like this.
      Loading editor
    • These assets are owned by the Community and not by yourself,they are remaining and any edits that have been made are remaining.

      These images are fair use, I've seen worse qualify under it.

      This is final

        Loading editor
    • Those assets belong to their author - me - and not to the community, copyright was at no point explicitly signed away nor were they released into the public domain. The edits to them do not qualify under fair use, as laid out under Section 107 of the Copyright Act:

      "Notwithstanding the provisions of sections 106 and 106A, the fair use of a copyrighted work, including such use by reproduction in copies or phonorecords or by any other means specified by that section, for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching (including multiple copies for classroom use), scholarship, or research, is not an infringement of copyright. In determining whether the use made of a work in any particular case is a fair use the factors to be considered shall include—

      (1) the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of a commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes;

      (2) the nature of the copyrighted work;

      (3) the amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole; and

      (4) the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work.

      The fact that a work is unpublished shall not itself bar a finding of fair use if such finding is made upon consideration of all the above factors."


      Given you are substantially using my original work in your new versions, are using it for the same purposes, and that you aren't using it for educational, journalistic, or critical commentary purposes, it would not fall under the scope of Fair Use.

        Loading editor
    • Why are you doing this.

        Loading editor
    • Hi, as I already said "I’m raising this issue because I sincerely am concerned about it. (...) While I am content with the work I originally let the group use staying in place (...) I am not however comfortable with the existence and use of these derivative versions of my work which I must note I did not consent to or authorize the creation of and did not give to the group for its use."

      I am uncomfortable with the creation and use of these unauthorized works, they are wrong and breach both the law and the Wikia Terms of Use as well as my will - I didn't ask for or agree to this, and as such would hope for SFMB to do the right thing and respect and comply with my request these unauthorized works be taken down.

        Loading editor
    • Well you seem to want permission for altering your work. If we remove these violations may we get that for future works?

        Loading editor
    • While I would have to handle such on a case-by-case basis, people have always been welcome to reach out about getting approval to make new versions of my work. Of course, I can't promise I'll always say yes (someone wants to, say, put a logo I made on top of a penis, it'd have to be a pretty funny penis for me to consent, lol), but I certainly won't always say no either.

      My priority right now however is getting these unauthorized works taken down for the aforementioned reasons.

        Loading editor
    • Hi, I'm still very much eager to see this issue resolved in a timely manner, thanks.

        Loading editor
    • Texar matey. You must understand most of us admins are busy with other frankly more important stuff such as uni, college or such.

        Loading editor
    • I understand that, but I also understand how easy it can be for this issue to be pushed off until it's forgotten, take the time you need but in that time I'll still be here waiting, I'm motivated to see a resolution to this and I fully intend not to give up on it.

        Loading editor
    • Im handling the situation now.

      I'd rather not risk getting sued at 17 and still in highschool cause some of us lack initiative.

      I can't blame you Tex, I can see you got an argument against, our "fair use" spiel. I dont wanna chance it. Getting your work stolen is also a pain in the ass, but, at the same time, I can't see the significance of these logos myself, unless you have some sort of digital design portfolio you're building. I can see that this means a lot to you, you personally, but you wanted to leave the group, you did. Why didn't you leave these logos behind? I dont see a motive, you wanted to leave the group in peace, and you did. But here we are, because someone increased the size of a banner? I don't know.

      I will remove this stuff anyway, cause I think it's the right thing to do for me and the other admins in SFMB you wanna sue. Im not sure how that'd work either, we're not an official organization but I'm no legal expert either. Who would fork over the money to extradite Matt and Surv from Europe and Asia to the USA for a trial. And most importantly: how would other see this action? Do you think people would rally behind you if you did all that? Sued kids, and adults from across the world over a logo to a ROBLOX group that you're not in anymore? I can't see the alterations of these works as the real motive. I just can't. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, none of my ideas are any good as to really why.

      I guess what Im trying to say is I dont understand why this is so important to you since you left the group. And  additionally I don't understand exactly why Bane wanted to make these new logos to begin with. He just made them, there was no deliberation to make them, he just drummed em up.

      It doesn't matter now, does it? Matt has a lawyer. Hopefully you have one if youre that serious about it. And hopefully this was all just a moot point cause no one is suing anyone since I'm gonna take it all down and that'll be that. I will be closing this thread since the issue has been resolved.

        Loading editor
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